sorry i think we have a very different definition of direct military intervention, then

my mind goes to boots on the ground, so to speak

Well those waterways in my proposal would be backed by military if Russia tries running it, but it would be considered reactionary seeing as iff Russia does try running it, it's breaking international laws if a country deems another country who is persona non gratis from running their navy through it.

If turkey blockaded Russia From using the straits of Istanbul it contains that portion of the Russian navy in the Black Sea, same thing with Denmark and the Baltic Sea it would be containment and if need be ALL RUSSIAN VESSELS and that would decimate Russia's economy.

that's probably fine, but we should keep our pants on and wait until russia does something outside it's borders to merit this

as much as it sucks to see em' build their military on their border, that is still their right as a nation state

Like I said it can only be used as a reactionary measure to rightfully justify it, you just can blockade people you like all willy nilly so then you still look credible.

Their shits held together by duct tape and WD40 and a good number of the troops there are conscripts that don't want to be there.

indeed

always gotta check with asshats like lindsey graham saying we should take actions like severe sanctions before russia does anything else

that and nukes

lots and lots of nukes

Opinions of people like hasan abi really anger me honestly, they don't know much about the situation. I live in a former soviet bloc country and Russia has always been a big threat to our democracy. (it's not even our neighbor) Every antiliberal party here (mostly fascist) has an ally in Russia. The conspiracy theories Russia is spreading are affecting a lot of people. Russia isn't hiding this, even their diplomats are very aggressive. Ukraine needs help, the people there have it many times worse than us.

You should see the subreddits for russia and news and politics the russianbots and germans are in full swing for damage control for losing the narrative.

I live right next to Ukraine, In Moldova, and if a full blown war starts I'm in deep trouble, might die or some shit, which would suck I think.

Fuck Russia, always has been a shitty country, for the entirety of history, there isn't a good thing that Russia has done to the world. My country is a shithole because of their stupid sOvIeT uNIoN and their stupid leaders. Aggressive and corrupt apebrain government.

They hold "peace keeper" troops in my country, they have been doing that for 3 decades as a threat to us not to join the European Union and get better. They are peace keepers just the same as the US spreads freedom in Asia and how China is the last sanctuary for democracy. They stole our exit to the sea during the Soviet Union and gave us a time bomb, Transnistria, full of brainwashed hoes, they are the only current country in the world that still have the communist hammer and sickle in their flag, self proclaimed country that no one recognizes and honestly no one should recognize, they are just terrorists. USSR invested into every single soviet republic, but mostly in Russia. Moldova's investments mostly went to Transnistria again, because they would rather feed themselves more and support their ideological war rather than help the territory they took by force from Romania. Republic of Moldova IS ROMANIA, Republic of Moldova is the territory called Basarabia and that is one half of Moldova, the main part of Moldova still being in Romania up to this day. We might be a country called Moldova, but we are not even the actual real Moldova, historically all the important events happened on the other side of the border.

I have been to Crimea before the war, in Koktebel, it was a beautiful place with an insanely nice beach. I guess I won't have a chance to visit it safely anytime soon.

Russia was always a bully, The Soviet Union was evil and communism never worked and will never work.

The nuclear energy decision was really dumb from Merkel

Not that I disagree but is the Russian Federation as it stands now communist?

I'm not certain of its political ideology but I thought they abandoned that after the fall of the USSR. Am I wrong?

At the end of this show we can assume that there was a deal between the elites of Ukraine and Russia to distract people from domestic problems and increase the rating of the government.

The ideology has nothing to do with it, not in the current context.

Very true but they knew this day was coming America is weak but since its not our country we will fight harder

Russia has has their eyes on Ukraine and Crimea for a good minute, and their presence of Russian troops along the Ukraine/Russian border doesn't really ease anyone in the terms of a possible conflict.

This could just be a big political shit test Putin is doing on Biden to see what he can get away with. Seems like everytime the U.S. gets a new president, someone wants to whip their dick out politically or show their ass militarily.

Putin does have the right to build troops along his side of the the border of any neighboring country, but if a certain country feels threatened by such actions, then it is also their right to react appropriately.

Putin can make claims that he has no interest of invading Ukraine all he wants, but with the mobilization of troop and equipment along the region doesn't help his claims at all, especially with the beef Ukraine and Russia has has in the past...yikes.

History doesn't repeat itself, but it does have a familiar tone. All it takes is one prick to invade a country, convince himself that he's now powerful enough to do it again because nobody challenged his power, and then do it again to a neighboring country. Which is why it's important for NATO and allies to remain vigilant and have a presence to keep an eye in case anything escalates further into something much worse.

I disagree with U.S. troops in Ukraine but not around Ukraine. Since you know? "We got the right to mobilize and drill." Isn't that right, Putin?

But I do see Putin's reasons for not wanting Ukraine to be part of NATO (they wouldn't have asked to be in NATO, if you weren't such a fucking prick in the first place...) because Ukraine kinda adds a "buffer zone" between Russia and NATO allies. If Ukraine does become part of NATO, then they'll can do militarily exercises right at Russia's doorstep, but he fucked up that possibility by making it look like he's preparing for large military action. Putin should have thought of it this way: "I don't have Ukraine, but at least they (NATO) don't either."

I really hope this doesn't boil-over into a literal 3rd World War, but only time can tell.

By the way: Russia is acting as the aggressor here. Even if they "had no intention of invading Ukraine" then they wouldn't have made their military movements look like such, which would have saved them the headache of dealing with this in the first place.

some talk about russia forcing conscription of ukrainian folk in donbas for the upcoming invasion; if that's true that shit's a pretty big warcrime (article 51 of the geneva convention IV)

good start, russia, gotta enter this thing with a bang, eh?

mostly twitter and hearsay for now, but in times of war this shit is hard to get really hard info on ahead of time

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/russia-ukraine-invasion-us-intelligence-orders/

Shit be gettin spicy

At 2/16/22 04:01 PM, DamnedByFate wrote:

: What we learnt is that war sucks and must be averted at all costs.

At 2/16/22 04:12 PM, Tony-DarkGrave wrote:

: I keep forgetting that's what they teach you you in German primary schools so the cycle of sheep's wool over your eyes continues.

You both are right.

I'm still not too sure what to make out of all of this. All the online info is too shaddy.

My rule of thumb: Neither side holds the truth. The actual truth is somewhere in between.

Russia is a dictatorship. period. And putin has the rep of tensing things up in ukraine and... invading.

I've seen some shit on Fox about Ukraine being a dictatorship and somehow siding with russia in the case of a possible invasion... are they high?

On the other hand the US may want conflict to arise to capitalize off of that. Now, whether it'll get involved in combat instead of just selling guns is questionable. After all, they did just loose against Club Sandals; the russians are gonna murder them, jesus.

A consequential day for the future of this conflict as well as US/Russia/China relations. Russia may even recognize separatist movements like the LDNR, but this is doubtful in my opinion. XI is expected to give a speech soon and I suspect he will wait to see how this all plays out before actually giving it. 2024 is also the date of the Russian Presidential elections and I wonder if that will color his actions a bit.

On principle I think separatist movements should be heard and taken seriously.

The left is itching for a chance to jail/execute anti-war protesters under "treason" charges. When you have over a million followers despite no recognizable achievements, I think it's fair to say you are largely representative of a large part of your group. Moreover, this is the exact kind of authoritarian heavy hand that they want use on everyone who engages in the slightest civil disobedience against their favored regimes, from the Canadian truckers to the January protesters.

If they dont invade in the next few weeks. They aren't going to at all. One of 2 things will happen if they do.

1. The world will find out why napoleon and Hitler weren't so stupid invading russia during winter.

2. Ukraine will be so fortified that they cant invade without leaving themselves laughbly vulnerable to counter invasion.

yeah, pretty much this

it's why a lot of folk are saying russia will likely invade in the coming days or weeks; russia doesn't seem like he's bluffing, but he only has so long to effectively do it

we can unclench a little if he doesn't invade by late march

Something worth noting is that tomorrow (2/22) is the anniversary of Viktor Yanukovych's removal from office amidst Euromaiden. Who among us is willing to bet that Putin would be in favour of changing the meaning of said anniversary in the minds of Ukrainians? (not to mention the rest of the world)

It would seem as though Vladimir Zhirinovsky's in on it, perhaps?

Guess we'll find out in a matter of hours.

Meanwhile in reality, the senate unanimously approved support for Ukraine's sovereignty. While Putin is trying to push his revisionist history, it is unsurprising to see this is a bipartisan issue in the senate.

so now an invasion of eastern ukraine will be framed as providing military support for a sovereign nation rather than as an invasion of ukraine

sounds about right

Pretty much. The only question is what the US response will be.

I told you today would be important!

hopefully, sanction russia after russia invades and continue to supply arms to ukraine as we have been in the meantime

otherwise, hopefully biden sticks to "no military aid for ukraine", we don't want two nuclear superpowers directly engaged with one another

i believed you, for once

Crimea 2.0

Sounds like there are already going to be targeted sanctions on those recognising Donetsk and Luhansk from the EU. If Russia moves in, which seems likely as of now, then there will most likely be broader sanctions imposed. Not sure if America will sanction until after an actual invasion takes place.

EDIT: Looks like America is sanctioning those regions directly with plans for more sanctions if an invasion occurs: “To be clear: these measures are separate from and would be in addition to the swift and severe economic measures we have been preparing in coordination with Allies and partners should Russia further invade Ukraine,”

Thank God a video! I was getting tired from all this reading